On the potential pardoning of Snowden.

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On the potential pardoning of Snowden.

1lriley
des. 25, 2020, 10:33am

I'm in favor of that.

2davidgn
des. 25, 2020, 10:36am

I suppose I am too. But it's Assange who really needs a pardon.

3LolaWalser
des. 25, 2020, 11:20am

something something Russia

4margd
des. 25, 2020, 1:24pm

Ghislaine Maxwell?

5davidgn
des. 25, 2020, 1:32pm

>4 margd: *snorts* We may see it.

6lriley
des. 25, 2020, 2:58pm

My educated guess on Maxwell and Epstein is they're deeply linked into intelligence services---my hunch would be the CIA and/or Mossad. No one has ever explained where Epstein got his wealth from. Both of them were very keen on Israel--Maxwell's father a very shady figure with links to Israel and who died under some very suspicious circumstances. The Epstein/Maxwell operation very much targeted the super wealthy, celebrities and the politically powerful and separate from the pedolphile side of it was pretty much a blackmail operation. That all screams 'intelligence' at least to me. Some government or two was behind them and protecting them and the sweetheart deal that Epstein got in Florida some 15 years ago also speaks to that.

I am not a fan of our intelligence services at all. Snowden's sin was to expose a lot of their shit to public. There has never been a CIA or NSA director that hasn't been amongst the most evil people on the planet and these agencies abrogate power beyond and outside their parameters all the time and our politicians never ever call them to account. The United States govt. and most of the politicians on both sides hate whistleblowing and whistleblowers of any and all kinds and this is all about that. They certainly aren't going to fix the negatives that Snowden pointed out---they consider themselves beyond critique.

7MsMixte
des. 25, 2020, 4:05pm

>6 lriley: I am not a lawyer, but I did ask the question about Maxwell in another forum which is packed full of lawyers.

Essentially, Maxwell could very well get a pardon. She would not necessarily lose her ability to invoke 5th Amendment protection against self-incrimination provided she could reasonably show possible state-level prosecution (or federal prosecution for still-not-pardoned federal crimes). It's almost guaranteed that New York State would charge her with several crimes. She's in a pickle, because Epstein's estate is being sued for damages by one of his alleged victims (Ms Giuffre) and Ms Maxwell's deposition from 2015 is being used to bolster Ms Giuffre's claims against the estate.

8margd
des. 25, 2020, 4:28pm

Epstein had all those homes. Lordy, I bet there are tapes.

9lriley
Editat: des. 25, 2020, 5:12pm

#7--she's also linked to Donald. There is that story about Donald and a 13 year old girl as well that just never seems to get a lot of attention. The problem there for Donald (I believe--and anyone can correct me if I'm wrong) that if he pardons her and then later she's subpoenaed to testify she's got to talk (and not be caught out on a lie or refuse to answer a question) or she risks being prosecuted again. That also would be a problem for a lot of other Epstein clients.