urania1 desperately seeking the perfect nudge

ConversesBook Nudgers

Afegeix-te a LibraryThing per participar.

urania1 desperately seeking the perfect nudge

Aquest tema està marcat com "inactiu": L'últim missatge és de fa més de 90 dies. Podeu revifar-lo enviant una resposta.

1urania1
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 11:16 pm


The Pile

No it is not a pipe, but it is a book pile (if one uses one’s imagination).

Why am I not conforming to accepted format and duly posting a photograph of the unread books in my library? Is it because I have no unread books in my library? Possible but not probable. Is it because I do not want to admit how many of my books I have not read? Improbable but possible. Is it because I am contrary? Some people would offer a thunderous “yes” in response. They would be wrong.

Truthfully, what I want is the nudge to the perfect book, the book I have not discovered yet, perhaps the book that has not been written yet. In short, I want a nudge for a book that is not in my library at the moment.

Perhaps you are remarking to yourself that you have better things to do than spend hours trolling through my library to see what I don’t have. I quite agree with you, so I will offer a few guidelines for my unconventional request.

What Not To Suggest

1. You can take for granted that I have read most if not all of the major canonical English and American literary texts even if they do not appear in my library. I am a former professor (lapsed rather than retired) of English literature. So I’ve been there and done that.

2. No Russian literature please. I am currently directing a reading group, the goal of which is to read all of Dostoevsky’s work, so I’m reading quite enough Russian literature and criticism at the moment.

3. I do not particularly care for mysteries

4. I loathe bodice rippers and romance fiction (of the heaving breast on the book jacket variety).

5. I do not want this to be one of the usual books that appears on suggestion threads. I am looking for the unknown, seldom discovered, the remote uncharted territory on the vast continent of my reading desire.

Now that I have covered the “absolutely do not suggest” criteria, on to suggestions for the “perfect book,” the sort of book one unwraps on Christmas day and says “aahhh.”

Acceptable Criteria

1. I prefer fiction although I am open to nonfiction (again I seek the unexpected).

2. I love wit, humor, and charm. I adore wit, humor, and charm even more when the work in question resembles an intellectually meaty bone.

3. However, wit, humor, and charm are not prerequisites nor is intellectual gravitas

4. I enjoy finding old and delightful (but not prohibitively rare or expensive) books that have fallen out of print.

Examples of Books I have Recently Discovered That Fall into the “aahh” (sighed with great satisfaction) Category

The Ten Thousand Things by Maria Dermoût
Pictures from an Institution by Randall Jarrell
The Land of Spices by Kate O'Brien
Messer Marco Polo by Donn Byrne
The Book of Blanche and Marie by Per Olov Enquist
Cassandra at the Wedding by Dorothy Baker
As I Crossed a Bridge of Dreams by Lady Sarashina
Faded Portraits by E. Breton de Nijs
The Margarets by Sheri S. Tepper

An Extremely Abbreviated List of Some Favorite Books

Villette by Charlotte Brontë
Aunts Aren’t Gentlemen by P.G. Wodehouse
No Bed for Bacon by Caryl Brahms et al
Troll: A Love Story by Johanna Sinisalo
Wives and Daughters by Elizabeth Gaskell
Germinal by Émile Zola
The Reindeer People: Living with Animals and Spirits in Siberia by Piers Vitebsky
Half a Yellow Sun by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie
Aubrey’s Brief Lives by John Aubrey
A Midsummer Night’s Dream by William Shakespeare
Le Petit Prince by Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Discipline and Punish by Michel Foucault
The Telling by Ursula Le Guin
Homer’s Daughter by Robert Graves
The Complete Works of Saki by Saki
Winter’s Tales by Isak Dineson
The Collected Stories of Colette by Colette
The Custom of the Country by Edith Wharton
Daphnis and Chloe by Longus

2Nickelini
nov. 12, 2008, 5:05 pm

Well, I don't think I can be much help--your brows are so much higher than mine, (although I like to think of myself as high brow.) I'm very cheered though to see that The Reindeer People is on your list--I just bought it this afternoon.

If you're looking for an out-of-print cult hit, I liked My Brother's Keeper, by Marcia Davenport. I'll give this some more thought and get back to you.

3urania1
nov. 12, 2008, 5:18 pm

Thanks Nickelini. I don't think my brows are very high at all. I'd call them distinctly middlebrows.

4cocoafiend
nov. 12, 2008, 5:24 pm

Hmmm, I'm an English lit ABD so your brows are higher than mine too... Nevertheless two books come to mind as equally, but differently, haunting and delightful: Fingersmith by Sarah Waters and The Double Hook by Sheila Watson. The former is well-written, intricately plotted, set in Victorian London. Waters is not particularly off-the-beaten-track, but if you haven't read her, she is wonderful. The latter is a gorgeously spare Canadian experimental classic set in the BC interior. Published in 1959, it's short but resonant.

5cocoafiend
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 5:33 pm

Oh, and I'll just add that I haven't read it yet (but I want to!), but Ngugi Wa Thiong'o 's Wizard of the Crow looks like it will be a great comic novel / political satire set in the imaginary African country Aburira. It's more than 700 pages long and I just don't have time right now, but if you're looking for something epic in scope, this might fit the bill...

6urania1
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 11:19 pm

Thanks cocoafiend. It's nice to meet another cocoa fiend. I haven't read Fingersmith, but I have read Tipping the Velvet - another one of those books that my local purveyor of books promised, promised, promised I would like. I was underwhelmed. However, it did remind me ever so slightly (and I am not sure why) of Joanne Harris's book Sleep, Pale Sister - an absolutely scrumptious gothic set in Victorian England - great for reading on dark gloomy days, especially if one has a cup of hot cocoa at hand (and if something extra has been tipped in the cocoa, all the better). Another book Tipping the Velvet brought to mind was Angela Carter's Wise Children. Again, don't ask me why? Incidentally, I really enjoyed both Sleep, Pale Sister and Wise Children.

And once more, my brows are middling!

7angelrose
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 6:17 pm

as far as wit, humor & charm are concerned, george saunders has been my favorite for the past eight years or so

i think he's getting more & more popular now but i guess i still think of him as mine (by which i mean i've mentioned his name to large groups of people (literature & philosophy majors) & no one knew who i meant)

as for obscure and/ or out of print there are two books that i discovered by happening to take classes with the erstwhile professors of the authors

my "undie" (suny brockport) pick is m. evelina galang's story collection her wild american self

& for grad school (suny binghamton) chloe georas' rediviva: lost in trance.lations

the latter (a collection of spanish & english poetry, photographs, a mirror, some gauze & a band-aid) is quite difficult to come by (at least in the u.s.) but the professor in question is teaching the book this semester, so you may be able to poach a copy if you follow this link:

http://binghamton.bncollege.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/TBWizardView?catalogId...

the book is for course number PIC 645 A-20

(for the record, my brow is uni)

8mrspenny
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 6:16 pm

I would describe my recommendation as thought provoking but definitely not highbrow and might just scrape into the lower middlebrow if generous but it is a very enjoyable read and one you could curl up with on a cold night with a cup of cocoa.

The River Midnight by Lilian Nattel

Another recommendation I thought of was Delphine by Madame de Stael - although you may have read this in your professional life - it is quite rare but still available.

9dylanwolf
Editat: nov. 12, 2008, 6:22 pm

OK, Mary. I'm wonderfully intrigued. I can't find any Elias Canetti in your library so I'm going to suggest one non-fiction book of his Crowds and Power and one fiction Auto da Fe. The first does what it says on the label - it's a wandering muse on all aspects of crowds and power.

Auto da Fe, I would suspect you have heard of, Canetti is surely not obscure, but, if not, is a nightmarish novel about a man with a library.

I would imagine that sci-fi is a genre you would not touch with a barge pole. Me too normally, outside of HG Wells, but take a chance on Stanislaw Lem and His Master's Voice. Lem, unlike most sci-fi novellists, is a writer of quality.

I'll ponder on because these are only my initial thoughts as to what might rock your boat.

10FlossieT
nov. 12, 2008, 6:34 pm

urania1, I'm going to nudge a book I haven't read yet, but our booksellers have picked it for their Christmas selection and they usually know their stuff: 24 for 3 - Jennie Walker. Although as it's about cricket it may not have crossed the pond yet (if it ever does).

It will be interesting to see what comes of your 'pipe'.

11urania1
nov. 12, 2008, 6:42 pm

Wow, my Christmas wishlist is filling up rapidly.

>5 cocoafiend: cocoafiend I've nearly purchased Ngugi Wa Thiong'o's Wizard of the Crow three times now and for some reason have paused. Who knows, perhaps the time is getting ripe.

>7 angelrose: angelrose - Both of your suggestions sound interesting. I also like the idea of tracking down books that are hard to come by. Thank you. If any more books come to mind let me know,

>8 mrspenny: Ah mrs p., I clicked on the description of The River Midnight and was quite charmed. As for Mme. de Staal, I'm familiar with her letters but not with Delphine. Incidentally, when I click on the title link it took me to Mary Stewart's The Moon-Spinners. I'm not sure how LT came up with that one.

>9 dylanwolf: - And dylanwolf, I've certainly heard of Canetti. I'm not quite sure why I haven't read anything he has written. Perhaps I have. I need to go check him out.

12urania1
nov. 12, 2008, 6:48 pm

Well I don't think it is cricket if it hasn't crossed the pond. So annoying when the Brits keep all the good books to themselves or make us wait a whole year for the book or worse yet redo the book with a tacky cover.

13christiguc
nov. 12, 2008, 7:02 pm

How about The Radetsky March by Joseph Roth or Women in the Wall by Julia O'Faolain? Have you read either of those?

Or maybe Morte D'Urban?

I agree with dylanwolf's suggestion of Canetti for you.

Have you read any Stefan Zweig? I recommend The Post-Office Girl, and I've heard Chess Story is good.

14wandering_star
nov. 12, 2008, 7:14 pm

Hmm... lots of books to add to the wishlist here! I would highly recommend The Book Of Chameleons by Jose Agualusa. You might also be interested in Typical American by Gish Jen - or anything by Jane Stevenson.

15Cariola
nov. 12, 2008, 8:18 pm

OK, I'll bite and give you two of my 'ahhh' books. You may have seen me recommmend them before as they're the first ones to come to mind whenver anyone asks for suggestions.

The first I already nudged on Kevin's list: The Impressionist by Hari Kunzru. It has been at the top of my list of favorite contemporary novels for several years now. Kunzru is brilliant. A lot of the reviews of the book blather on about it being a parody of Kipling's Kim and a critique of British colonialism. That may be so, but what captivated me (aside from the imaginative and often outrageous plot) is that it is an exploration of identity. What determines one's identity? Is it a name, a relative, an ethnicity, a skin color, gender, nationality, education, associations, history, . . . ? Are we who we say we are, or is identity what others perceive or force upon us? Can we consciously reshape it? All these are questions that the novel raised for me--but it never hits you over the head with them. They are buried in the remarkable and surprising and sometimes funny story of Pran (well, that's the first of his many names), who learns to take advantage of his somewhat slippery identity. I've never read anything quite like it. I used the book in an Honors course I taught on identity, and the students also found it fascinating. Despite what might seem like a rather dry analysis on my part, it's a beautifully written and fascinating novel.

The second is a somewhat lighter but also enjoyable bit of biofiction with the regretable title Passion. (It's only somewhat redeemed by it's subtitle, "The Romantic Poets and the Women Who Loved Them.") It's quite different than the typical historical novel about Byron and Shelley in that the point of view shifts among a series of women who played important roles in their lives: Mary Wollstonecraft, Mary Shelley, Claire Clairemont, Lady Caroline Lamb, Byron's half sister (whose name is escaping me at the moment), Fanny Brawne, and others. I thought Morgan did a remarkable and fairly realistic job of portraying what it must have been like--especially for intelligent, creative women--to be devoted to one of these brilliant but ultimately self-absorbed poets. My only minor criticism is that the Keats/Fanny section wasn't too successfully linked to the rest of the novel. Of course, Keats WAS rather on the periphery of the circle; but perhaps, although I enjoyed this section, it shouldn't have been forced into the framework.

16Nickelini
nov. 12, 2008, 8:45 pm

Cariola is one of those high brow English professor types too. :-)

17urania1
nov. 12, 2008, 10:04 pm

I am enjoying this forum immensely. So many interesting titles.

>13 christiguc: Christina, I see a lot of NYRB authors there. They've sort of been on my list for a while; however, I tend to approach NYRB cautiously. Some of the press's authors write lovely prose; others strike me as somewhat pretentiously intelligent without the saving grace of being good storytellers. Not having read any of the particular NYRB authors you've mentioned, I'm not in a position to comment here. However, NYRB did put out one of my all-time favorite books The Ten Thousand Things, so I cannot really complain.

>14 wandering_star: wanderingstar, I have two books by Jane Stevenson: Good Women, which I've read and The Winter Queen, which I just purchased and have not read. I haven't read any Gish Jen, so she's a possibility. The Book of Chameleons sounds like the most intriguing of your suggestions.

>15 Cariola: Cariola, wow what a list. I'm feeling quite nudged. Do you have any other titles you wish to share?

P.S. dylanwolf, I do read science fiction, but I'm extremely picky about what I like. Most sci-fi I pick up and don't bother to finish. I have read Stanislaw Lem's Solaris. It was okay, but I didn't keep it. I sent it on its way to another home. Perhaps I need to give Lem another chance. I do like Ursula Le Guin, particularly her later work. I find the combination of her powerful storytelling and feminist Taoism a particularly irresistable combination.

18kiwidoc
nov. 13, 2008, 12:29 am

What a fun thread - really gets the thinking caps on!!

Some of the gems I have recently read have been Marion Barbery and The Elegance of the Hedgehog, The Blue Flower and Telling Tales by Alan Bennett. Also just starting a great looking book The Visit of the Royal Physician. I wonder if you have read these ones??

It is much tougher to think of a jewel of a book than to expound on a pile. MUCH harder.

19timjones
nov. 13, 2008, 1:14 am

I'm going to put in a science fiction nudge - short and not part of a series: The Fifth Head of Cerberus by Gene Wolfe. The most literary of SF writers.

20cushlareads
nov. 13, 2008, 2:45 am

I'm thinking...but every time I think of something that might work you've read it already! I was going to suggest A Thread of Grace, wondered if it wasn't highbrow enough, but then saw that you have it. I'm going to give you a big anti-nudge for Dreamers of the Day by the same author.

I will do some more thinking after I've checked out more of your library and all your aaaah books and added them to my wishlist in BookMooch.

21aluvalibri
nov. 13, 2008, 8:11 am

After giving it some thought, I decided to nudge a few Italian books by different authors, some of whom you know.
Not in order of preference:

House of Liars by Elsa Morante
Family Sayings by Natalia Ginzburg
Dust Roads of Monferrato by Rosetta Loy
Acquainted with Grief and That Awful Mess on the Via Merulana, both by Carlo Emilio Gadda
The Baron in the Trees and Marcovaldo by Italo Calvino.

I have been endorsing House of Liars for quite a while, and so I apologize for repeating myself, but I cannot leave out a book that, in my opinion, is one of the masterpieces of Italian literature of the 20th century. The only problem is that it is not easily found and the very few copies around are expensive.

22tomcatMurr
Editat: nov. 13, 2008, 10:26 am

This is a great challenge! I'm going to nudge some books to do with China for you, as I see you only have a few in your library, and I'm hoping that more reading about China will give you that *new* feeling.

Two fictions about revolutionary China, both of which are strong on the wow factor, at least for me:
Victor Segalen probably the more witty and charming of the two
Man's Fate certainly intellectually meaty, fabulously descriptive but low on humour

A contemporary Chinese writer, in my opinion the best novel to come out of China this century:
A Dictionary of Maqiao by Han Sahgong (big big nudge for this one).

And finally, not about China at all, but an absolutely hilarious read with lots of intellectual meat if you know how to look for it:
Myra Breckinridge/Myron by Gore Vidal

Enjoy!

23media1001
Editat: nov. 13, 2008, 10:38 am

For an unusual book, not really a story as much as a reading experience:

Exercises in Style by Raymond Queneau

I know you aren't partial to crime and mystery, but these two books are very well done and intelligent:

The Glass Key by Dashiell Hammett
The Talented Mr. Ripley by Patricia Highsmith

If you want some short stories from a very, very good writer:

The Collected Stories of Amy Hempel by Amy Hempel

Eastern philosophy and spirituality:

Siddhartha by Hermann Hesse

Sci-fi you might actually enjoy because it is clever and witty:

Hitchhikers' Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams
The Midwich Cuckoos by John Wyndham

Other random books I enjoyed:

The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test by Tom Wolfe
Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas by Hunter S. Thompson
If on a Winter's Night a Traveler by Italo Calvino
The Butcher Boy by Patrick McCabe
Veronika Decides to Die by Paulo Coelho
Geek Love by Katherine Dunn
Life of Pi by Yann Martel

Hope this helps.

-- M1001

24juliette07
nov. 13, 2008, 12:39 pm

media 1001 - Siddhartha by Hermann Hesse - mmm interesting - I wonder if urania has read it. I am still thinking.

25Cariola
nov. 13, 2008, 4:24 pm

Well, another "ahhh" selection was Joan Silber's wonderful book of short stories, Ideas of Heaven: A Ring of Stories. The title was a bit of a turnoff; I wasn't sure what to expect, but I'm not one who reads much about religion or faith. (I'm one of the few who detested Gilead, for example--found it a real bore.) But I'm glad I gave it a chance. The stories all deal with people coming to grips with or finding faith in unexpected circumstances. Not religious faith only, but also faith in oneself, faith in other people, etc. And all of the stories had a link to another in the collection. For example, the missionaries in China in one story end up being the ancestors to a woman taking dance lessons in another. As someone who is not a churchgoer and not religious, I was surprised to find this book moving me in unexpected ways.

26jmaloney17
nov. 13, 2008, 4:44 pm

I just looked over your library. If you have not read anything by Barbara Kingsolver, I think you should. Everyone knows The Poisonwood Bible, but I suggest Prodigal Summer. It is not really a study of society, but more of a man v. nature. The female characters are strongly drawn.

I saw you had a couple of books by Isabel Allende, bur I did not see Portrait in Sepia. It is one of my favorites by her.

For a humorous look at a fictional modern British monarchy, try Freddy and Fredricka.

The Binding Chair is an interesting look at foot binding.

There is a play that you have likely read, but I thought I would throw it in here anyway, Long Days Journey into Night.

For a few non fiction books try The Glass Castle by Jeannette Walls. It is an autobiography of her childhood. Makes you realize how great yours was in comparison.

Also look at Stiff by Mary Roach. I was always interested in what happens to a person when they die. This answered all my questions. It has a lot of humor in it, so it is not daunting to read at all.

I also liked Nickel and Dimed by Barbara Ehrenreich. She basically tried to live and work like someone who lives on minimum wage. It is an interesting premise. I would like to see something more in depth though.

All three of the non fiction books are short. I hope you find some good stuff.

BTW--Since you read so much Brit Lit... Do you know the name of the book that the servants used in 18th/19th century? It has all the ettiquette they were supposed to use. They mention in sometimes in Brit lit when they talk about the servants and their responsibilities. I just have not come across it in a while and I cannot think of the name. I am curious if it is still in print. It would be interesting to read. I am facinated with all the etiquette and expectations of people then.

27urania1
nov. 13, 2008, 4:48 pm

The suggestions get more exciting by the moment.
>18 kiwidoc: kiwidoc, I’ve read all the books on your list except for Telling Tales. I love Alan Bennett and nearly hit the "put this in cart button" for it a few weeks ago, but my fingers froze or else I had to beetle off to battle with dust and Republicans.

>19 timjones: timjones, I've read one book by Gene Wolfe The Shadow and the Claw - something to do with torturers and really bizarre sadomasochistic forms of death. It turned my stomach a bit, so I passed it own.

>20 cushlareads: cmt, I like Mary Doria Russell best when she's in her science fiction mode. I thought The Sparrow and The Children of God were both excellent as well as thought provoking. Each raised difficult ethical questions. In fact, we're reading The Children of God as an ancillary text in a philosophy reading group that I lead. I liked A Thread of Grace, but I didn't think it came anywhere near the level of Russell's first two book; consequently, I've put off reading Dreamers of the Day.

>21 aluvalibri: Paola, why doesn't it surprise me that you're out there pushing Italian writers. I love Morante, Ginzberg, and Calvino, although I haven't read any of the titles you list except for The Baron in the Trees. Calvino is marvelous. Loy is a new name to me. Gadda is not. Doesn't he write mysteries? Mystery/detective fiction has to be really good for me to like it. The Name of the Rose is my idea of the perfect mystery.

>22 tomcatMurr: tomcatMurr, Are you perchance a fan of E.T.A. Hoffmann or Robertson Davies or both? I ask because of your name. As it turns out, A Dictionary of Maqiao is winding its way to me via abebooks. It is interesting that you should note the paucity of Chinese fiction in my library. I read a bit more than shows up, but I've sent it on its way. So much of current Chinese fiction in translation revolves around the trials and/or triumphs of victims under the "evil" Mao. While I'm not going to hand out the humanitarian of the century award to Mao, I can't help but feel that the pervasiveness of the anti-Maoist theme is anything but accidental. I think it suits the propaganda machines of China and the US at the moment. Furthermore, I suspect publishers seize on this particular themed work because Americans read it and feel so self-congratulatory afterward. I'm all for popping that little self-congratulatory balloon. We have a lot to answer for in this country. That said, I've recently been on an Asian kick, but going back quite a bit further in time. I will definitely check out the titles you have recommended and would be curious to hear your thoughts on the state of contemporary Chinese literature. I have been spouting off without the least bit of firm knowledge.

>23 media1001: media1001, No longer quite the elusive mystery man you were before. Thank you. You are one of the few people I know who has read Geek Love. I found it an "interesting" book and I would recommend it to others under certain conditions. Have you read any Kathy Acker perchance? Douglas Adams I love, and I'm really pissed off that he died before writing one more book. I adore his Dirk Gently Holistic Detective Agency series. And yes, Hitchhikers' is a hoot. I'm not familiar with John Wyndham. I read Steppenwolf by Hesse back when I was fifteen, had brows higher than the Empire State Building, and was into appearing world-weary and blasé. I couldn't tell you a thing about Steppenwolf now (I must have been to world weary to pay attention or else I was distracted by the splendour of my high eyebrows. I was also in my Carlos Castaneda phase had the time. I have read Hesse's collection of fairy tales recently and quite enjoyed them. Raymond Queneau has been on my list of authors to investigate for a while. As for Life of Pi, I've avoided it like the plague. I even regifted an unread copy. (I hope the gifter isn’t an Lter.) So . . . here's the challenge: Give me five really sound reasons why I should read this book, which sounds like philosophy-lite - a sort of Sophie's World for non-Scandinavians.

And last but certainly not least - Julie. I see you're still being coy and won't commit to a book. Hmmm. Perhaps a mutual friend of ours might be willing to join book nudgers and offer some suggestions. Would you like to invite her? I wonder what she would have to say?

28FlossieT
nov. 13, 2008, 5:33 pm

>27 urania1:: urania1, I didn't like Life of Pi much, but it is kind of interesting to read it along with The Narrative of Arthur Gordon Pym to see what Martel did with a lot of the same elements (and some of the same names, and pretty much the same structure). Only really half a reason, I admit. Maybe someone else can find another 4.5?

29Cariola
nov. 13, 2008, 5:53 pm

Another short story collection that was wonderful: The Deportees and Other Stories by Roddy Doyle. All of the stories involve recent immigrants to Ireland, whose booming economy has apparently made the country an attractive haven. The stories are extremely varied in tone and content, but many of them had me in tears--tears of laughter. The title story is about Jimmy, the lead character in The Commitments, who is now in his forties, married, with three kids (two of whom are named Smoky and Mahalia). He wants to resurrect the group and sends out a call: "No Irish Need Apply." Another, "Guess Who's Coming for the DInner?," is told from the POV of a father whose daughter has invited home "a black fella." It's very clever--mostly his internal efforts to convince himself that he's not prejudiced--and has an unexpected ending. Others, including one about a boy who recently arrived from a war-torn African nation and another about a Russian girlfriend, are a bit more serious. It's a grreat collection and spurred me to read a lot more of Doyle's work.

30amandameale
nov. 13, 2008, 6:03 pm

I recommend Music and Silence or The Colour by Rose Tremain. Both wonderful.

31aluvalibri
nov. 13, 2008, 6:12 pm

No, Mary, Gadda did not write mysteries. His books are pervaded with a very subtle sense of humour. In my opinion he stands alone in the panorama of Italian lit, not because he is the greatest, but because his style and stories are peculiar. I think you should give it a try.

P.S. I would not suggest mysteries as I know you are not fond of the genre. Incidentally, I agree with you on The Name of the Rose....GREAT!

32rbhardy3rd
nov. 13, 2008, 6:13 pm

Okay, Ms. Urania. I've transported over from the Virago group, and find myself overwhelmed with the number of messages already posted. I agree with you and Paola about how wonderful Italo Calvino is. Invisible Cities is astoundingly beautiful. You are so well-read, it is a formidable task to attempt to nudge you. But here are some suggestions of books that are on my To Re-Read List:

•Flann O'Brien's At Swim-Two-Birds
•Andrej Bielyj's St. Petersburg
•Vladimir Nabokov's Pnin and Pale Fire
•Carol Shields' Swann
•Derek Walcott's Omeros (Barack Obama was recently sighted carrying around a volume of Walcott's poetry)
•Virginia Woolf's Between the Acts

Meanwhile, in the midst of my usual Viragos, I just finished an excellent general educated audience book on economics: Charles Wheelan's Naked Economics. Now I'm thinking about reading Richard Hofstadter's classic Anti-Intellectualism in American Life. I'm also in the midst of a two-year project of reading all of The Federalist. Best to take it slow. Want to join me?

33aluvalibri
nov. 13, 2008, 6:17 pm

Rob, I am SO happy to see you here!!!!!!!!!!!
:-)))))

34rfb
nov. 13, 2008, 6:26 pm

>26 jmaloney17::
If you're into literature about China, what about City of Broken Promises by Austin Coates? Again, its based on political (historical) events but covers trading in the 18th century. The protagonist is a Chinese orphan who becomes the first female Chinese trader. I can also recommend Myself a Mandarin by the same author, a biographical account of his experience as a Special Magistrate in the 1950's in Hong Kong.
And I enjoyed Heaven Lake a lot. Even better: its not (or hardly) political...

35tomcatMurr
nov. 13, 2008, 9:40 pm

#27: Yes to ETA Hoffman and Robertson Davies, although I wasn't aware that RD also uses the name Murr.

I agree with you that publishers are keen to translate and make available to Western readers those books that they feel are going to sell, i.e: My-terrible-life-under-Mao stories. However, I think a lot of Chinese writers are only recently feeling liberated enough to start writing about those experiences. What lifts the Dictionary of Maqiao above other contemporary works, imo, is that it is also an extended meditation on how the language has been changed by recent Chinese history. And its those changes in the language, ironically, that restrict contemporary writers. I'm very interested to hear what you have to say about it.

Another Chinese writer from the early revolutionary period that you might like to try is Lu Xun Diary of a Madman. His works have only recently become available in translation, but he is one of the key voices from what I call the Shanghai renaissance, of which Eileen Chang was a part.

36urania1
nov. 13, 2008, 9:45 pm

>29 Cariola: Cariola,
You certainly make a strong case for Doyle's book. I'm accumulating a great list here.

>30 amandameale: amandameale
I love Rose Tremain. I have read both of the books you mentioned. Her Music and Silence is on my top 100 books of all times.

>31 aluvalibri: Paola, thanks for clearing up my misconceptions about Gadda. He's on NYRB isn't he? I need to take stock and do a group order from Symposium or Book Culture.

>32 rbhardy3rd: Rob!!!!! I'm so glad you're here. I've got At Swims-Two-Birds. I started it a couple of summers ago but was interrupted and didn't pick it up again. I remember thinking it was funny, reminiscent of Joyce perhaps (if my memory is correct here). Funny you should mention that The Federalist Papers is one of your long-term projects. I've been looking for a reading partner for The Federalist Papers ever since I read John McGowan's American Liberalism: An Interpretation for Our Time. Are you familiar with his work? McGowan teaches English and critical theory at UNC-Chapel Hill. He's absolutely brilliant. His book draws heavily on the The Federalist Papers, and I found myself ashamed that I was so ill versed in the political literature of my own country. Would you like a reading partner? I realize I'd have to catch up with you. I've read the Woolf. As an undergraduate, I took a seminar completely devoted to her work, so my library is pretty "Flush" with her texts. Richard Hofstadter's Anti-Intellectualism in American Life sounds good too. I've spent the past week trying to explain to my Swedish relatives, the strong strain of anti-intellectualism that runs through American culture and how it affects everything. I don't think they believe me. Perhaps we could read that one together as well if you're interested.

>34 rfb: rfb
All of your titles sound interesting. I'm accumulating quite a wishlist from everyone's recommendations.

37polutropos
nov. 13, 2008, 10:09 pm

Mary,

it is a little scary trying to recommend a book to you, even with that little profile you give of yourself at the top. Let me ask a question before I do. Do you find Kafka's The Metamorphosis funny?

38cocoafiend
nov. 13, 2008, 10:15 pm

The invitation for an open nudge is generating great discussion! A lot of really interesting books out there...

urania1, thanks for the Sleep, Pale Sister and Wise Children recommendations. I've read and loved Angela Carter before so I'm adding Wise Children to my 999 Challenge list. I'll look into the Harris too. I've thought a bit more about your criteria and have a few more suggestions.

W;t by Margaret Edson is witty yet profound and so so brilliant. It's a play about a professor of 17th century poetry (John Donne's Holy Sonnets) who is dying of ovarian cancer. Funny and thought-provoking.

Pricksongs & Descants by Robert Coover - stories that demonstrate what a brilliant writer can do with the short story form

In the Red Kitchen by Michèle Roberts - full of great female characters (mediums and pharaohs) and encompassing ancient Egypt, 19th century London and 80s UK

Time's Arrow by Martin Amis - brief and ingenious, told in reverse to sometimes comical, and sometimes devastating, effect

Country of My Skull by Antjie Krog - non-fiction about testimony from the TRC hearings in South Africa - a combination of journalism, memoir and prose poetry. Harrowing at times, but so illuminating. It has a memoir-like narrative structure, in which Krog, a South African journalist, is the "I".

Anyway, that's my two bits. I don't envy you your task of choosing just one of the many fascinating books people have recommended! I guess that's a problem we all face every day. May the force be with you...

39torontoc
nov. 13, 2008, 11:01 pm

I would recommend The Bastard of Istanbul by Elif Safak. This is the book that led to charges against the author ( they were dropped ) in Turkey. I heard an interview with Safak and was interested to learn that she grew up in a house of women almost like the characters in her novel.

40urania1
nov. 13, 2008, 11:13 pm

>26 jmaloney17: jmaloney17 I think our post crossed at approximately the same time, so I have just now noticed it. Regarding Barbara Kingsolver, for some reason I cannot get into Kingsolver's work even though everyone I know loves her. Possibly, I have not yet reached the right stage in my life to appreciate her work. Certainly, this has been true for a number of books that I now dearly love but once found uninteresting or worse. I enjoyed Nickled and Dimed and have taught it a number of times in freshman composition classes. The Allende book sounds interesting as does The Binding chair. I read a scholarly work on footbinding this summer Cinderella's Sisters: A Revisionist History of Footbinding. I'm still considering the author's thesis and haven't made up my mind. Additionally, my knowledge of the practice is limited.

> 37 Andrew, I wouldn't say I find Kafka funny as in haha funny, but I do think he's brilliantly sardonic.

>38 cocoafiend: cocoafiend I've read Wit and loved it. Being a lover of John Donne's poetry and having been treated for cancer, the play resonated with me. Your other suggestions sound interesting as well although I can take Coover or leave him most of the time. And you're right, I'm going to need the force here . . . or lots of Christmas presents.

41timjones
nov. 13, 2008, 11:18 pm

#27: I see what you mean re Shadow and Claw. I don't recall anything particularly gruesome in The Fifth Head of Cerberus, but maybe my standards have become debased ...

A couple more nudges: Lanark by Alasdair Gray and The Vintner's Luck by Elizabeth Knox. The latter is by an NZ writer, but has been published fairly widely & shouldn't be too hard to get hold of.

42urania1
nov. 13, 2008, 11:25 pm

>41 timjones: Lanark sounds interesting. Alasdair Gray has been on my "authors I need to get around to reading " list for a long time now. Vis a vis Shadow and Claw, I read it because a colleague (and a quite conservative one at that) recommended the series. I was fascinated because after reading the book, I found it quite revealing about the colleague. I think the book was interesting though. I'm not familiar with Elizabeth Knox.

43Nickelini
nov. 14, 2008, 12:00 am

Andrew - what does it mean if one finds Kafka's Metamorphosis funny? I think I could fall into that category. It's not Fawlty Towers funny, and there's a lot more going on than just humour, but yes, it's funny in its own way. Do I need to get therapy or something?

44timjones
nov. 14, 2008, 6:24 am

42: Lanark is pretty much sui generis (maybe Dennis Potter's "The Singing Detective" is the nearest equivalent in a different medium). Not always easy, but it has stuck in my mind for a long time. Elizabeth Knox started out in the New Zealand heads-down, no-nonsense realist tradition, but has branched out into various forms of fantasy and fabulation, though still with very much a literary sensibility. The Vintner's Luck is about the relationship, sexual and otherwise, between a French vintner and an angel. I'm not a huge fan of her work in general, but she does write very well, and I enjoyed this one.

45zenomax
Editat: nov. 14, 2008, 7:17 am

I have three suggestions (none of which I have read - but all of which I have bouncing around in my mind at present):

Patrick Leigh Fermor's only work of fiction, The Violins of Saint Jacques was mentioned on a recent programme on BBC Radio 4.

From the comments on the radio, it would appear to be up to the standard of his non fiction - which is a very high standard indeed.

R C Hutchinson has had some press recently as the author of several 'lost masterpieces'. His book Recollection of a Journey seems particularly interesting.

His name came up in an article in the Guardian newspaper over here in the Uk several months back. It related to how as the modern printing process allowed small runs of books to be printed economically, Faber & Faber were to print small runs of 'lost masterpieces' based on user demand. The key is that the demand can be very small and still provoke a print run.

If you Google ' R C Huthinson lost masterpieces' it should take you to an on line Guardian article where authors talk about their favourite 'lost masterpieces' - it might give you more reading ideas...

Third Robert Musil, The Man Without Qualities. You may have already come across this, but it is considered, I think, another lost masterpiece of the twentieth century. And like most authors of 'lost masterpieces' I think this author's own life would make a good book. I believe this last book may keep you from LT for a period of time - it seems to have taken Musil most of his life and resources to complete.

46FlossieT
nov. 14, 2008, 7:39 am

The Faber imprint mentioned in zenomax's post is Faber Finds, and it has lots of interesting stuff on. They started with an initial print run of only a handful of titles, but I believe the list has expanded to over 150 already. Includes things like now-out-of-print Booker winner P.H. Newby. Not just fiction either.

You can also email suggestions of out-of-print titles you'd like to see to their 'Lost and Found' - lostandfound@faber.co.uk. No guarantees obviously but it's an interesting idea.

47aluvalibri
nov. 14, 2008, 8:04 am

FlossieT, interestingly enough I got an e-mail from Faber & Faber earlier this morning, and promptly suggested a book.
It will be interesting to see the developments (provided there are any.)

48FlossieT
nov. 14, 2008, 8:20 am

aluvalibri, me too :-) - that's what made me think of posting here!

49aluvalibri
nov. 14, 2008, 8:21 am

Great minds think alike!!!!!!!
:-))

50polutropos
nov. 14, 2008, 9:33 am

#40 and #43 (a brief hijack of this thread to talk about Kafka)
All I was doing, Mary and Joyce, is checking the level of kindred-spiritness. I found The Metamorphosis very funny, while most readers, I believe, do not. I am most pleased you do. Psychotherapy needed? Well, sure, doesn't everyone?

Here then, Mary, are three works you may already know, but if not should go on a future reading pile:

A very recent small, amusing book by Paul Torday called Salmon Fishing in the Yemen, a novel about fishing combined with political satire, bureaucrats, the Middle East, the war in Iraq, and a sheikh who is really a mystic. Clever light read.

Good Soldier Schweik probably still the most important novel written in Czech even though it was first published in 1923. A key anti-war novel, influencing both Remarque and Heller, who said if he had not read it, he would not have been able to write Catch-22. Hilarious on top.

The Aleph by Borges. I also find Borges funny. Psychotherapy definitely needed.

51zenomax
nov. 14, 2008, 10:37 am

polutropos - perhaps the world can be divided into three types of people - those who find Kafka funny, those who don't find Kafka funny, and those who don't know who or what a Kafka is.

I'm with you. Right from reading my first - Blumfield, an elderly batchelor - I have found his writing amusing, I often smile to myself while reading him.

urania - sorry for hi jacking but its an interesting side thread running here.

52Nickelini
nov. 14, 2008, 11:11 am

#50 - I found The Metamorphosis very funny, while most readers, I believe, do not. I am most pleased you do. Psychotherapy needed? Well, sure, doesn't everyone?
----------------

Whew, what a relief. I was worried. Okay, then, I think I'll start off with some aromatherapy before I commit to the psychotherapy.

53dylanwolf
nov. 14, 2008, 12:09 pm

Metamorphosis funny? On yer bike! What would be the point of finding Kafka, Dostoyevsky or Camus funny? It would be sacrelige, like turning up to a funeral with a crimson carnation button hole that squirted water. Chekhov's plays are achingly melancholic. I hate it when people start laughing and pointing out that Chekhov thought them tragi-comedies. He was wrong!

Can't you leave us depressives to enjoy our sombre, melancholic classics without turning up like Krusty the Clown with custard pies and bicycle horns telling us how funny they are?

54Nickelini
nov. 14, 2008, 12:19 pm

Excuse me, Mr. Wolf, but Krusty the Clown is not funny. Come on--a guy wakes up to find he's turned into a giant bug, and his biggest concern is "how am I going to get to work" --now THAT'S funny.

55aluvalibri
nov. 14, 2008, 12:20 pm

I will have to agree with Joyce on that.

56dylanwolf
nov. 14, 2008, 12:31 pm

Well, OK but, you know, that is reading the book as though it was meant to be realistic. Poor Gregor has become transformed into something repulsive and he does what we all do, he attempts to hide it by acting as though nothing is wrong, even when that is obviously impossible. This is a horrifying situation not a comic one.

Yes, I know, that sounds all a bit pompous, but I don't think it's right to ignore the genre and act as though Kafka was PG Wodehouse. Now Woody Allen, say, writing on Kakfa, that is funny.

57zenomax
Editat: nov. 14, 2008, 12:33 pm

Surely even melancholics can have fun sometimes?

Melancholy fun... what a concept to conjure with.

58dylanwolf
nov. 14, 2008, 12:42 pm

A melancholics idea of of fun is to stare out a rain streaked window past the bare trees to the dredger clanking tirelessly by some rusted dockyards.

It is possible I'm just a bit grouchy. It's been a long week and I'm tired. Sorry Joyce and Paola! The concept of finding Kafka funny seemed to touch a nerve like someone giggling in church during a memorial service.

59polutropos
nov. 14, 2008, 12:44 pm

And this current diversion which I began is FUNNY.

Yes, it is, is not, sure it is, no way.......LOL

As Zenomax said in #51, polutropos - perhaps the world can be divided into three types of people - those who find Kafka funny, those who don't find Kafka funny, and those who don't know who or what a Kafka is.

I am all for melancholia, and have been seen as morose and depressive, even manic-depressive sometimes. I don't find Chekhov funny, but will allow some may.

And perhaps we should now leave poor Gregor Samsa to his struggles, and get back to recommending books to Urania1.

60aluvalibri
nov. 14, 2008, 12:46 pm

Kevin, perhaps it could be tragicomic? And the giggling at a memorial service might be a nervous reaction???

61dylanwolf
nov. 14, 2008, 12:50 pm

OK Andrew, it is a bit unfair on Urania1. One last Kafka joke though...

Franz Kafka walks into a bar. He orders a dry martini. The bartender asks, “Do you want that with an olive or a twist?” And Kafka replies, “I choose despair.”

62urania1
nov. 14, 2008, 3:19 pm

Wow, this thread gets ever more interesting. I feel I must weigh in once more to the great Kafka Human Comedy or Human Tragedy Debate. Dylanwolf, I'm sorry you're having a gritchy week, but I am working hard to repress a giggle. During the last memorial service I attended (for my mother-in-law), my stepson and I struggled to keep straight faces. Unfortunately, the two of us had driven up to Chicago for the service and during the drive suffered from a combined case of gallows and Monty Python bring-out-your-dead humor. Our trip did not serve us well at the service. We didn't dare look at each other, but at the same time we couldn't resist. When my time for a memorial service comes, I hope everyone is rolling in the aisles with laughter. It's the best way to go. Oh, and I want comic songs and a P.G. Wodehouse sermon.

But I digress. Per Kafka, poor Gregor's situation is much like that of the emperor who has no clothes. If one is the emperor (and realizes one has been duped), the situation may or may not be funny. It can be funny if one realizes the extremes to which others will go to avoid pointing out this fact to one. Admittedly, this situation may not be so funny for the audience. The preceding situation, of course, requires an emperor with éclat, élan, and a sense of humor. However, I will agree that if the emperor is your basic depressive type, he will find absolutely nothing humorous upon suddenly discovering he has no clothes on and at a public processional no less. In fact, I would hazard a guess that he may become quite testy especially if it starts to rain and he gets a head cold. Equally plausible with the depressive-type emperor is the possibility that he has chosen to hang out at a nudist camp and forced all of his court to come along. I haven't personally been to a nudist camp. Living on a secluded mountaintop, I feel no need. I simply strip whenever I feel like it. However, based on descriptions I've read, nudist camps sound like pretty depressing places. Let's face it, our society has not advanced to the point where it accepts that sagging breasts, cellulitic arses, and the other accoutrements of the body’s transition to another state may be aesthetically pleasing. Instead, we prefer botox, nose jobs, tummy tucks, etc. How depressing. This is where one finds Rabelais a great comfort. He understood the joys of the excremental body and reveled in them.

But back to the emperor. He's hanging out at the nudist camp and finding out that his courtiers are just as disgusting as he has always suspected. So of course he gets grumpier.

And of course we have the fourth possibility, that called the possibility of just dessert. On rare occasions, poetic justice and just desserts meet up. At such times, a naked emperor can provide an occasion of carnival for the crowd especially if the emperor's ass is particularly pompous. Such fun for them. And in such a case, you have to admit the emperor probably deserves it. So is it comedy? Is it tragedy? It all depends on whether you're standing upwind or downwind of the naked pompous ass when it lets fly.

P.S. The book suggestions are getting better by the moment as is the discussion. So hijack away.

63dylanwolf
nov. 14, 2008, 3:42 pm

Ah, but our divested (and unvested) emperor is merely suffering from hubris and will surely bluff his way back from the buff. Gregor, on the other hand, is suffering from existential angst and internalised self-loathing; his condition unsaveable and irredeemable. As for dessert, may I have the profiteroles?

64kiwidoc
nov. 14, 2008, 4:10 pm

Hate as I do to admit this, I am in the same group as Kevin - getting to work looking like a bug would severely worry me!!!!!!!!!! I wish I could change!!!!!!!!

65joiedelivre
nov. 14, 2008, 4:43 pm

Urania1, I see you have one book by B.J. Chute in your library, but it's not Greenwillow. I LOVE that book. It's gently funny, lovingly descriptive, and the best book to curl up with on a rainy afternoon, with a hot cup of tea or cocoa. It's one I've come back to over and over; kind of like comfort food.

66aviddiva
nov. 14, 2008, 5:15 pm

Urania, I have been somewhat intimidated about nudging you, since the brows of my library are considerably lower than yours and I enjoy some genres which you do not, but since the search for the insufficiently recognized gem intrigues me I will present a few of my off the beaten track favorites for your consideration. Most are light reading, and none are probably destined to be classics, but all merit a look.

Fantasy and fairy tale retellings:

Enchantment by Orson Scott Card. Card is a very uneven writer, but this retelling of a Russian version of sleeping beauty, complete with Baba Yaga, is one of his best.

The Perilous Gard by Elizabeth Marie Pope A well written retelling of the ballad of Tam Lin. YA.

The Silver Curlew and The Glass Slipper by Eleanor Farjeon Charming older children's retellings of Tom Tit Tot and Cinderella.

The Forgotten Beasts of Eld by Patricia McKillip. This is one of her earliest and has lovely lyrical language. It is the sort of fantasy that either you will love or you won't like at all.

Witty, humorous or charming books:

The Horses of the Sun by Oriel Malet. A charming coming of age story that takes place in Italy. Malet was a friend of Daphne DuMaurier.
My Family and Other Animals by Gerald Durrell. Not unknown, but very funny.

"Chewy" books of one sort or another:

An Instance of the Fingerpost by Iain Pears. A mystery, but a very chewy one. If you are fond of The Name of the Rose, you might enjoy this one as well.

A Mantis Carol by Laurens Van der Post. This book is difficult to describe, but worth seeking out. It is non-fiction that reads like fiction.

The Gold Bug Variations by Richard Powers. A twisty interweaving of two parallel stories, rich with descriptions of music and the discovery of DNA. It is told in the form of a set of 24 variations like Bach's Goldberg variations. Literary fiction for lovers of science and music.

67avaland
nov. 14, 2008, 5:16 pm

Sorry to be late to the party. Mary, I do so love a challenge. *rubs hands gleefully*

First, I must second Cariola/Deborah's nudge of The Impressionist by Kunzru.

Second, I must nudge an author--- Algerian author Assia Djebar---less for the actual books and more what she is trying to do in her literature. I think her earliest book translated into English is Children of the New World (touchstones have gone totally bizarre!), written at the age of 26. Women of Algiers in their Apartment is a great collection, although some of the stories are hard to follow. She attempts to mix song, poetry and sometimes the cadences of Arabic into her prose. I think I would recommend reading Children first as a warm-up before getting into the later books. The introductions are excellent also.

Lastly, a SF recommendation. I Who Have Never Known Men by French (or maybe Belgian) author Jacqueline Harpman. This is a carefully crafted book narrated by one of 40 women who have been imprisoned in a cage underground after some unnamed apocalyptic happening. I dare not say more without introducing spoilers or, if not actual spoilders, the very details that are so interesting to discover on one's own. It is a very thought-provoking, short novel.

68urania1
Editat: nov. 14, 2008, 11:44 pm

> 66 aviddiva, what a thoughtful list. As it turns out, one of my favorite genres is the fairy tale/myth retold. I am picky. I've read a number of books in this genre that were disappointing or else utterly wretched, but when one happens on the perfect retelling . . . ahhh what bliss. I have read The Forgotten Beasts of Eld and found it quite enjoyable although McKillip doesn't usually do much for me. I tried to read one Orson Scott Card novel years ago but didn't finish. However, Enchantment sounds like a definite book to put on the too read list. I'm sure you're familiar with Robin McKinley. Her book Rose Daughter is a gorgeous retelling of "Beauty and the Beast." Rose Daughter is actually her second reworking of "Beauty and the Beast." Her earlier work Beauty is quite good as well. Disney ripped off a good bit of Beauty for its movie (and gave no credit to good ideas). I also enjoyed Deerskin. I've read one Iain Pears novel: The Dream of Scipio, which I quite enjoyed. Oriel Malet is a name that keeps turning up, so she's definitely on my to read list.

>67 avaland: avaland Beat you to it. I've already started I Who Have Never Known Men. As for Assia Djebar, you're breaking the rules. No recommending books you recommend all the time. This has to be the treasure, so wonderful but so . . . . that it doesn't even occur to you to recommend it.

The Impressionist is getting quite a few nudges, so many that it hardly qualifies as the rare treasure, but I think I will end up reading it at some point although not for this nudge.

69avaland
nov. 14, 2008, 10:15 pm

>68 urania1: caught again! *scurries away to the bookpile to reconsider*

70timjones
nov. 14, 2008, 10:59 pm

#68: fairy tales retold - try Thornspell by Helen Lowe - Sleeping Beauty retold from the prince's perspective.

71Nickelini
Editat: nov. 14, 2008, 11:04 pm

#69 - caught again! *scurries away to the bookpile to reconsider*
------------

I tell ya, Lois, she *pretends* to be one of the hoi polloi, but really . . . did you notice those highly arched eyebrows? I've given up. . . . Oh, hold on! My humanities class just read H.D.'s Helen in Egypt, a 300+ page Modernist poem. Most of the class just scratched our heads and sighed: "What the . . . ," but now that I think of it, that Helen had some pretty high eyebrows too, and the language is terribly evocative. Hmmm.

Edited to add: and Helen in Egypt is a re-telling of all the Helen of Troy myths, so that should fit the criteria.

72joiedelivre
nov. 15, 2008, 1:41 am

Urania1, have you read any of the Elemental Masters series by Mercedes Lackey? They are all re-tellings of fairy tales, some of them with quite an inventive twist.
The Fire Rose
The Gates of Sleep
The Serpent's Shadow
and several others.

Also, her Tales of the Five Hundred Kingdoms are a highly amusing take on fairy tales.
The Fairy Godmother
One Good Knight
The Snow Queen
Fortune's Fool

73juliette07
nov. 15, 2008, 2:51 am

aviddiva My Family and Other Animals by Gerald Durrell - what a good one and I bet it fills all those pesky criteria regarding charm and wit!

74juliette07
nov. 15, 2008, 3:06 am

Phew - just read the Assia Djebar comment. I spent hours pondering if I should suggest The Tongue's Blood Does Not Run Dry.

I have read your acceptable criteria very carefully Ms Urania and come to the conclusion that a challenge is what may be needed. We all know what too much charm and humour can lead to …

So my first nudge is towards The Lying Days by Nadime Gordimer. Novels that reflect insight into historical settings in which oppression and the all pervading ethos and context of challenging times fascinate me. I am wondering if they do so for you. For me this is not a conscious effort but rather one that I have realised with the passage of years. (Please do pass me my magnifying glass!)
Gordimer writes of vast issues but with individuals right at the heart. This novel is set in South Africa of the 1950s. She puts the flesh and bones into a situation. She writes of the specific individual as one immersed in their historical, political and social surroundings. My suspicion is that you would either love it or loathe it.

Secondly, Woman at Point Zero by Nawal El Saadawi . Based upon the author’s encounter with a woman imprisoned in Qanatir prison in Cairo, Egypt this novel was written by Dr Nawan El Saadawi, a psychiatrist who came upon a woman in solitary confinement, awaiting her execution. She is an Egyptian feminist novelist born in 1931. A challenging read in terms of content yet written in a sparse and apparently simple style. This is a powerful and uncomfortable story with a depth of meaning far beneath the surface of the words. Doris Lessing wrote of this book as one in which we are reminded not to take our good fortune for granted. That certainly rang true for me and compelled me to ask how am I using the freedom that I have? Urania – I also think you would wish to read it as following the first 1978 Arabic publication in Beirut it was banned across several middle east countries, including Egypt.

Whilst I have read your criteria very carefully, it may be a matter of opinion if my next nudge conforms to number 5. Oh no just read criteria 2. Such a STUPID student she NEVER reads the question! Please humour me.
I would nudge you towards a book of which left me with a very strong desire to encourage others to read this work. Do not shie away from it, persevere through the first part, do not be discouraged. Most of all please do not think that you are in any way not 'good, or clever enough' to enjoy it - it is not an endurance test, a badge of office to be won or a medal winning feat to have read it! So my next nudge is War and Peace. However, the fact that it is not in your library may be speaking for itself!

Moving swiftly on. How about a nudge towards a Newbery Award? I see we share a few! The Twenty-One Balloons by William Pene du Boiswould be my Newbery nudge. I suspect the humourous situation would appeal. It is the 1948 Newbery award winner, a brilliant book ranging from scientific truths to absolute fantasy. Underneath all the fantasy there is a depth and a number of truths regarding ‘teamship’ and questions regarding riches. Desperately trying to make up marks the student refers to criteria 4 at this point as it was a very old copy I managed to order from my library!

Very finally The Wreck of The Zanzibar by Michael Morpurgo. My favourite contemporary fiction for children. A charming, (at last I get to criteria 2) delightful work with a hint of intellectual bone. It is a literary work for children set in The Scilly Isles in the form of a diary and so on that theme we come full circle back to Possession which I didn’t mention as it is too predictable and does NOT conform to the criteria!

75juliette07
Editat: nov. 15, 2008, 3:08 am

Agh - a double post. ETA I only pressed the button once, honestly.

76dylanwolf
nov. 15, 2008, 3:19 am

>66 aviddiva: & >73 juliette07: I remember the Gerald Durrell books from my youth. Wow, yes, funny and light especially My Family and Other Animals, his brother Lawrence, must have had at least a twinge of envy at Gerald's popular success.

His African animal zoo-collecting books are funny too, The Bafut Beagles and so on. Although they appear non-PC these days it is probably OK, Gerald Durrell's zoo in Jersey is uniquely dedicated to the conservation of endangered species.

Mind you this is not deep literature - you can read them in one lazy afternoon sitting - perfect for a deckchair in a sunny garden.

77rbhardy3rd
nov. 15, 2008, 9:04 am

I completely agree with Julie about Nadine Gordimer's The Lying Days.

Have you read Doris Kearns Goodwin's Team of Rivals? Barack Obama and I would probably both put it on a list of our favorite nonfiction books.

I also recommend a book called Mansfield Park by a little known author named Jane Austen. I hear it has one of the best heroines in English literature.

78urania1
nov. 15, 2008, 10:42 am

>74 juliette07: Julie, you may bide your time, but you definitely come up with winners. I have read War and Peace. The first time I read it was the summer after my fifth-grade year. I was 11 at the time. I remember reading all the love and courtship sections and skimming/skipping the the war sections. My less than humble opinion at the ripe old age of 11 was that Tolstoy clearly needed my editorial skills. I was busy writing my own 20-page "sweeping" epic novel at the time and considered myself something of an expert.

>77 rbhardy3rd:, as for you Rob, I'm going to ignore that little Mansfield Park jibe. If yo want to worship Fanny as the woman of your dreams, go ahead. I'm not bitter. Nevertheless, having read and reread MP many times, I think I know a thing or two about sly young minxes like Fanny. She having you on, and you've fallen hard.

79staffordcastle
nov. 15, 2008, 11:49 am

Another vote for Gerald Durrell - I loved all his animal-collecting books, and My Family and Other Animals is a favorite, re-read many times. (Though I see I haven't gotten it in to my LT catalog - must go root it out.)

I even persuaded my family into visiting his zoo on Jersey!

80viragodiva
nov. 15, 2008, 1:31 pm

How delicious. My nudge would be towards Fanny Hill: Or, Memoirs of a Woman of Pleasure
by John Cleland. It is full of charm and an awful lot more....

81urania1
nov. 15, 2008, 3:07 pm

>80 viragodiva: Diva darling, as you know me so well, you know I've read Fanny Hill . . . many times.

82cornpuff12
nov. 15, 2008, 3:21 pm

would people get mad if i started a teenage mount to be read and a teenage book nudgers? i really need to, because most of the boards here are adult.

83Schmerguls
nov. 15, 2008, 3:32 pm

I presume everything you have read is listed on your site. If this is correct, you do not seem to have ead a favorite of mine:

Lady Into Fox, by David Garnett. I read it July 30, 1950, and have never forgotten it.

It will only take you a short time to read and I would wonder what you would think of it.

84FlossieT
Editat: nov. 15, 2008, 5:03 pm

>68 urania1:, interestingly, Fire and Hemlock, which I mentioned on my own thread in response to your admission of loathing for Ms DWJ, is also a re-telling of Tam Lin. It really is good, honest.

Also, for Hari Kunzru, I personally would also give a vote for Transmission. I don't think it was that successful commercially, but Granta used an extract from it when they elected him a 'Best of Young British' novelist, and I really enjoyed it, even if it does go slightly French-farce towards the end.

Edit to correct touchstone - sorry.

85mrspenny
nov. 16, 2008, 1:32 am

#74 - I'll second Julie's nudge for Woman at Point Zero. It is excellent.

86cocoafiend
nov. 16, 2008, 4:00 am

Hmmm... I feel I've plunged out of my depth here. I clearly don't read as much fiction as many LTers. Perhaps we need category posts - looking for a poetry nudge, in search of a great biography... to highlight other nudgeable book forms. Anyway, I'll just sit back and appreciate the clamour of nudgery.

One last thought for urania1: Lying: A Metaphorical Memoir by Lauren Slater. Is it fiction? Is it memoir? Is it an incredibly witty pathological liar inventing a new genre? Who knows, but it is hilarious, intelligent, and completely unexpected. Even my students enjoyed it.

87aluvalibri
nov. 16, 2008, 9:48 am

#82> cornpuff12, of course you can start a teenage mount TBR! We shall be delighted to nudge!!!!
:-))

88Cariola
nov. 16, 2008, 5:38 pm

Wow, you're a hard sell! Two of us recommend The Impressionist and it no longer qualifies as a rare treasure? ;)

89Cariola
nov. 16, 2008, 5:41 pm

>84 FlossieT: I enjoyed Transmission, but it didn't make me think nearly as much as The Impressionist. I was rather disappointed with Kunzru's third novel, My Revolution.

90juliette07
nov. 17, 2008, 2:37 am

Yes Cariola - seconded nudge! Admit I'm biased due to setting but brilliant!

91avaland
nov. 17, 2008, 12:28 pm

>88 Cariola: Yeah, I was tempted to second the Nawal el Saadawi that juliette nudged (which would now be a '3rd'), but taking into account that my seconding of The Impressionist disqualified it, I held back.

I also read Transmission but wasn't wowed by it.

92urania1
nov. 17, 2008, 4:07 pm



CHECK BACK LATER. STASTICAL INSTRUMENT CALIBRATION IN PROCESS

93bleuroses
Editat: nov. 19, 2008, 2:40 am

Crossing the line here, but this thread has brought to mind Rosencrantz and Gildenstern (a la Tom Stoppard) as full of chance and possibilities. Not their end....but simply their 'play'!

94urania1
nov. 21, 2008, 1:33 am

I love Rosencrantz and Gildenstern Are Dead. Alas, if only it were still out there unread by me.

95urania1
nov. 25, 2008, 11:11 pm

The winners for this month/next month are as follows:

The Man without Qualities
The Wizard Crow
My Family and Other Animals
Lady into Fox

However, a number of other titles have gone on my wishlist.

96zenomax
nov. 26, 2008, 7:33 am

Splendid choices.

I expect an erudite review of Musil's book once you have finished it! (I need a nudge to read it)

97A_musing
Editat: nov. 26, 2008, 12:08 pm

Well, now, I'm just discovering this whole group, because I ignored the message Avaland left me back when I was excrutiatingly busy in the world. It sounds like you're well taken care of for now, but I can't resist weighing in for the next round.

I have a whole (but small) category coded in my library that I think gives you what you are looking for here. The code is "underappreciated little gems", but here's a taste of a few that I'd highly recommend if you haven't read them already (and these are nudges not sludges, for, while I enjoy a good slog, these are all easy afternoon reads):

(1) Thomas Mann, The Transposed Heads - it's a simple little legend he picked up in India about a girl and a couple of boys who (literally) get their heads all mixed up over her.

(2) Kalidasa, The Recognition of Sakuntala - think India and a cross between Antigone and Hamlet but a few hundred years earlier than one and later than the other. A classic but all too rarely read in the West. Inspired Goethe.

(3) Dissertation upon Roast Pig by Charles Lamb - this essay retells a legend from China, with humor courtesy of 19th century England. Who would have guessed they had humor in 19th century England? This may be one of those things you read in your professorial days, but, I don't know, Lamb seemed to be out of favor in the academic circles I once traveled (as was anything that might be disparagingly tagged "romantic"...)

I may be repeating myself, as I've raved about all these elsewhere on the site, but, then, one advantage of getting older is that you don't get bored repeating yourself.

98yarb
nov. 26, 2008, 12:10 pm

You've opened up a great thread here which I'll be mining for some time - thanks!

I get the feeling from looking at your favourites that you might like:

The Polyglots by William Gerhardie
Stoner by John Williams
Langrishe, Go Down by Aidan Higgins

all of which are essentially portraits, or for a chuckle:

His Monkey Wife by John Collier.

99urania1
nov. 26, 2008, 2:34 pm

>97 A_musing: Thanks A-Musing, I'm off to browse your library. Thanks for the suggestions yarb. I'll do some research.

100tiffin
nov. 27, 2008, 9:46 am

I'm here unabashedly stealing ideas for Christmas presents.

Urania, my all-time most favourite comfort read is E.F. Benson's Mapp and Lucia series, which should be read in order as the characters build and grow through the books. It starts with Queen Lucia then progresses to Lucia in London (my least favourite of the series), followed by Miss Mapp and Mapp and Lucia my two most favourites of all, ending with Lucia's Progress and Trouble for Lucia. I get transported to the town of Tilling (based on the real Rye in England), with Benson's deadly observations about the gentry of England between the wars. This is not, repeat not, taxing stuff. It is pure escapism and fun.

I found James Branch Cabell funny in a sardonic kind of way with his Jurgen series but haven't read it in yonks. I think it would hold up...

Delighted to see Sherri Tepper on your list with The Margarets.

For the worst poetry ever written in the English language and a great laugh, try William McGonagall's Collected Poems. He is very much of the "A cow it is a forlorn thing/A sheep is is forlorner/It stands there in the pouring rain/A leg at every corner" school of poetry.

101urania1
nov. 27, 2008, 11:48 am

Oh tiffin,

I love, love, love, adore E.F. Benson (especially the Lucia novels). Why did he have to die. Lucia and Mapp could have gone on forever.

102rebeccanyc
nov. 28, 2008, 9:48 am

I've just learned about this group and am mightily impressed by many of the suggestions here and will be adding many to my own TBR list. I know you've already made your choices, but I can certainly cheer your choice of Wizard of the Crow, one of my favorite books of last year (warning: it can take a little while to get into it, but stick with it). If you like it, try his Petals of Blood, quite different in tone; it's the book that got him arrested.

I can also second the suggestion of The Radetsky March, one of my favorite books of the year, a bleak look at the end of the Austro-Hungarian empire, with memorable characters.

Patrick Lee Fermor was mentioned. His A Time of Gifts and Between the Woods and the Water are amazing and hard to describe. The story of the first two legs of his walk across Europe at the age of 20 or so, just before the second world war, they combine a look at a vanished world with adventure, history, art, classical commentary, natural history, wonderful characters (that is, real people), and much more, all in an inimitable writing style.

103Novacek
juny 22, 2010, 7:33 am

i really wonder about the interview that you've been told.could you please send me a copy of it or help me to find.because i am an elif safak fan and i want to learn anything about her.thank you=)