How do you catalog 'Doubles'?

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How do you catalog 'Doubles'?

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feb. 19, 2007, 11:01pm

LT is rolling out a way to deal with multiple authors.

See the discussion thread over on "Recommend Site Improvements":

How do you catalog them now? If you have any suggestions for how LT should deal with "Doubles", now is the time to pipe up.

Editat: feb. 20, 2007, 12:28am

As you know, Bob, I list them as 2 different books, adding parenthetical info to the title about the other novel & the Ace double #.

I don't think that the multiple author scheme applies. That's really for collaborations. (By Niven & Pournelle, not one novel by each.) I suspect that Doubles will have to wait for the "works within works" anthology system to come along for there to be an ideal way (well, a better way) to enter them on LT.

feb. 22, 2007, 2:27pm

I'm with the previous poster; they should be treated like anthologies.

My current cataloging of them is a total mess. You're right that the Amazon data for any double book is completely broken; a few people at PaperBackSwap (which uses the Amazon APIs) have been grousing about the way Harlequin Duets have been entered. Luckily for them there were a lot less of those than there are of Ace Doubles.

The University of California has data on quite a few Ace Doubles; however, they've catalogued each half as a separate book.

feb. 22, 2007, 2:41pm

Can we access the U of California library for them?

feb. 22, 2007, 10:57pm

It's one of the libraries that LT searches, so yes.

feb. 22, 2007, 11:10pm

Picking up the observation that they're actually "anthologies":

You're right... when the 'multiple authors' system gets rolled out, we could actually treat them as anthologies:

List Donald A. Wollheim as the editor, and the actual authors as secondary authors. (Wollheim did buy the stories, and he made the pairings....)

(Silly as it is, that would avoid giving either author priority as 'first author', which is arguably important for these books.)

I don't want to list each book twice; I must have 300 of the various 'doubles', and that would inflate the stats.

feb. 23, 2007, 12:14am

Hi Bob,

There is plenty of inflation already for no very good reason. On Shakespeare's page, I see titles like "Hamlet (in the Complete Works of Shakespeare)" by William Shakespeare. Well, duh. Hamlet probably is included in the complete works. :-) I've seen mention of catalogs listing the same title hundreds of times.

If listing 300 more books (you do have 600 "works") is better for organizing your collection, I'd say that that should be your priority.

feb. 23, 2007, 12:49am

Hmm. The typical Ace Double is so (...shall we say...) un-good that I don't much consider the individual 'works'; I think of the book-as-an-object on my shelf.

Silly as it is, using the 'editor' work-around might actually be a useful way to think of them within the constraints of LT's cataloging.

Another passing thought is to use the 'Ace number' as the title... at least then, they sort easily in chronological order. (Mostly....)

feb. 23, 2007, 1:45am

Hmm. I don't have very many Aces. But a list I found shows that Aldiss, Delany, LeGuin and many other top writers were pubbed in Ace Doubles. I'd want to have those listed by title & author.

10RicketyCat Primer missatge
Editat: feb. 27, 2007, 2:28pm

I'm rather new to LT. I've only got the first 900 (give or take) books entered. I had left off the Doubles entering until now since I'm at the end of my SF shelves for cataloging.

I do like the multi-work/multi-author within a single work approach myself. However, because of the way LT organizes itself, I am entering each of my (paltry) 72 doubles as two separate works.

Here's why: listing them as a single work using the "editor" method requires combining a multi-author entry with each of those author's main entries.

Compare that with the mess a book like The Planet Pirates entails. It is a book that has 3 authors in collaboration. In this case, a multi-author entry combining with each separate author's main entry makes sense, but is very messy.

A double is two separate works without collaboration and therefore should not be entered as such. For example, The Jewels of Aptor and Second Ending.

Another kind of problem will occur even after the roll-out: Ace F-149, Cosmic Checkmate and King of the Fourth Planet. This one has one collaborative book and a single. With the new system, will it be entered as two works with one collaboration (i.e. Cosmic with a main and an other)?

Until the multi-author entry method is available, I'll keep going this way. Once it does roll-out, though, I'll fix my entries to reflect these doubles as single entities.

març 27, 2007, 10:44pm

I'm glad this is being discussed. Late last year I responded to a question at this discussion:

In explaining how I post Ace Double covers on LT, I was summarily reamed. (It's the only negative encounter I've ever had on LT). A couple members felt that my method of entering Ace Doubles (entering each book twice) was corrupting LT. I'm still not sure what was wrong with my original method, but I changed it.

març 28, 2007, 7:07pm

Corrupting LT! Good grief!

LT has a "works" concept, right? If I have 2 different novels, I have 2 works.

Entering both also passes Tim's cocktail party test. No one is going to say "I really enjoyed Ace Double #__!"

març 28, 2007, 7:52pm

Corrupting... Made me smile. I have entered some of my books multiple times so that I have a record of each book within an anthology.

But I smile because my prejudice is for people who enter books that they want to read someday. Talk about corrupting data. But then I remember that our catalogues are for ourselves and all that matters is that we enter the data that best suits our own needs.

The problem I'm having with that is that I don't think what I've chosen always works for me. I will be really glad when we have the anthology feature.

març 28, 2007, 8:33pm

myshelves at #12: Entering both also passes Tim's cocktail party test. No one is going to say "I really enjoyed Ace Double #__!"

Now, that made me smile. . . because I just might say something like that...

...good old "D-421"... or maybe "G-597"....

març 29, 2007, 12:30pm

I did think of saying "No one with the possible exception of AsYouKnow_Bob." But then I thought that you'd just stop conversation dead at that cocktail party, so it wouldn't count. :-)

març 29, 2007, 8:44pm

Funny you should mention that - my college friends run heavily toward electrical engineers and programmers. . . and it's been noted (by our more mainstream friends) that there comes a point in the evening when the conversation sometimes turns entirely into numbers and acronyms (to the bewilderment of the non-techies present).

(E.g., "Well, you could use a 555 for that...")

Editat: des. 3, 2007, 8:33pm

Well, to revive an old thread... looks like Help Is On The Way:

" We recently added a more robust system for other authors, including separate standing for each author and a role (eg., Editor, Illustrator).This feature is currently available for newly-added books only, but it will be extended to all books soon."

(This little tidbit of information is now at the bottom of the "work" page.)

maig 6, 2008, 9:42am

I've been adding each book twice with "(Ace Double x-xxx)" to link them together. It throws the counts off but makes it easier to catalog for me.

gen. 4, 2009, 9:27pm

I am not sure what trouble there was prior to this, but when I entered my Ace Doubles it recognized that there were two books in one and even sometimes shows both covers now.